Piracy helps anime DVD sales.

[Haruhiist]

This link will have NSFW images on it. And I mean nudity.
http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2011/02/03/japan-piracy-increases-anime-sales/


Japan’s prestigious Research Institute of Economy, Trade and Industry (RIETI), a government-affiliated economics think-tank, has published detailed research suggesting anime piracy can boost disc sales.
The official English language abstract of the (lengthy and highly technical) research – the paper itself is only published in Japanese:
Do Illegal Copies of Movies Reduce the Revenue of Legal Products? The case of TV animation in Japan
Whether or not illegal copies circulating on the internet reduce the sales of legal products has been a hot issue in the entertainment industries.
Though much empirical research has been conducted on the music industry, research on the movie industry has been very limited.
This paper examines the effects of the movie sharing site Youtube and file sharing program Winny on DVD sales and rentals of Japanese TV animation programs.
Estimated equations of 105 anime episodes show that (1) Youtube viewing does not negatively affect DVD rentals, and it appears to help raise DVD sales; and (2) although Winny file sharing negatively affects DVD rentals, it does not affect DVD sales.
Youtube’s effect of boosting DVD sales can be seen after the TV’s broadcasting of the series has concluded, which suggests that not just a few people learned about the program via a Youtube viewing. In other words YouTube can be interpreted as a promotion tool for DVD sales.
The research itself provides detailed statistical analysis of each title featured (mostly popular late-night anime), even going so far as to incorporate such factors as the popularity of the seiyuu involved in the titles, what medium the anime was adapted from and which demographic it targets.
Each factor’s estimated impact on the likely effect of online distribution on sales is then extrapolated using regression modelling.
Sankaku Complex provides a translation of the study’s key conclusions:
We compared the DVD sales, DVD rental sales, YouTube viewing numbers and Winny download numbers of various anime titles.
Our results suggested the following:
1. YouTube viewing did not decrease DVD sales, but actually increased them. For each 1% increase in YouTube viewership a 0.25% increase in DVD sales was observed.
2. The effect of YouTube on sales was particularly pronounced in the case of shows which had finished airing on TV. We can think of this as people who never saw the broadcasts becoming fans by way of YouTube and then going on to buy the DVDs.
3. There is no clear effect on DVD rentals from YouTube. At the very least we can say it seems YouTube has no adverse effect on DVD rentals.
4. Winny file-sharing has no effect on DVD sales, but does appear to decrease DVD rentals. People who download anime via Winny appear to be using it not to replace their purchases, but to replace their rentals.
As YouTube is having no adverse affect on anime sales, but is in fact increasing them, further distribution on YouTube is likely desirable.
Copyright holders who dislike YouTube and persistently request their works to be deleted from YouTube are likely to be harming their own business.
As a result of these findings, we can probably conclude that banning downloads of such material is a mistaken policy.
The usual proviso that correlation does not equate to causation naturally bears mentioning when presented with any study based chiefly on statistical observations. It should also be remembered these results solely concern the Japanese market and have nothing to say about fansubbing or otherwise.
Of course, these results should not be misconstrued as an endorsement of piracy – most anime production is funded primarily through DVD sales, so it is still essential fans at some point buy DVDs themselves, and the fact that TV, YouTube and P2P viewing is usually at much lower quality (whether in terms of image quality or dehumidification) than a disc always provides a strong natural incentive to buy.
Rather, it would seem online distribution has a crucial role to play in promoting anime to as wide an audience as possible and allowing this audience a preview of the full product available to paying customers – a fairly basic realisation to all but the most stubborn and unreasonable of copyright holders.
The research also tends to contradict government policy, which has recently seen unauthorised downloads criminalised, and soon threatens to ban ripping of DVDs and CDs altogether, a move which might have rather serious effects on the DVD rental business as well as on consumer freedom, and which, if this research is to be believed, would only further harm the anime industry.

Piracy = Fanbase outside Japan = Sales, even if they could get even more profit from pure pirates.

No Piracy = No Fanbase outside Japan = No Sales at all, less profit than the former.

[Scott]

Fans outside of Japan doesn't guarantee sales. Many people simply wouldn't bother buying it stating that they've already seen it in the superior Japanese language and currently don't have the money to buy it. Anime fans are cheap like that.

[Haruhiist]

Out of the millions of anime fans outside Japan, many of them buy stuff. That's still more than no one outside Japan buying anything. Like, personally I'm buying/importing stuff from Japan.

It's just whether the companies don't like piracy because they are getting less profit than they think they should be getting or whether they just don't like the idea of foreigners getting their product for free.

[Kraid]

I don't watch much anime and manga. However when I do I usually watch it online first THEN if I like it I end up buying the boxset of those DVDs.

However I still need to find and buy Pandora Hearts.

I do the same with PSP games. I don't really like piracy at all but I will buy the games and all that when I have the chance too (Usually I do have the chance.)

[TWOxACROSS]

Fans outside of Japan doesn't guarantee sales. Many people simply wouldn't bother buying it stating that they've already seen it in the superior Japanese language and currently don't have the money to buy it. Anime fans are assholes like that.

Much more applicable.

It's sort of a double-edged sword, I think, because I also think about the English market for stuff like this - or at least the American one. Like you said, Scott, many will say they already saw it (and if I ever heard someone say "in its superior Japanese language" I'm liable to punch them. It sounds incredibly pretentious :x), which would lower the chances of it seeing a release in the English market, receiving a dub, and helping the English VA business (which gets shit on constantly by Japanophiles).

Like Kraid, I'd at least like to poke at something to see if it actually piques my interest, and unfortunately, finding a stream, or downloading it is the only way I can get a demonstration. Places don't really rent ("hire" for you EUs) out Anime because of the niche-type market people see it as, so it leaves you little choice, y'know?

It's like...what if Pokemon never came out here? Of course, we know that it could be huge given how Pokemon is now, but say no where outside of Asian-speaking countries knew about it. Either, Japan finds some way to completely cut off the international market from it, meaning Japan-only sales, and acne-faced shut-ins importing stuff, which is not an international market at all >.< Or, they let it get pirated, people start seeing the show, toys, and games, which makes them look at the fact of "Holy shit! People love this!" and start selling internationally, making a multi-billion dollar international business off of little kids' allowances, and whatnot.

It sucks that that's the way it is, because there are some anime that is quite frankly just really good, and it should be seen by those who like anime of that sort. Sometimes you just have to take a chance, I guess, and this is what they are seeing as the best way to get money. It's a bit of risk and reward, rather than playing it safe and getting almost nothing at all.

[Ghurdrich]

Not to mention, a lot of the case for piracy is that this stuff is just not available outside Japan. After all, If there's no official english subs for an anime, why would I buy it? That case is clearly in favor of piracy. Games are the same. You wanna region lock your system? Well, that's fine. But it means that instead of buying/importing your game, now I have to download it and you get no sales. Likewise if I have to buy something off of eBay, that's likely a resale, and you the developer don't see a dime of that. So to me it comes down to availability.

[Sephiroth]

This is old news, this has been theorized not only for anime but for movies and games as well.

[Titanium Man]

It's the same issue with, say, Kamen Rider. Right now, Kamen Rider OOO is airing in Japan, and I keep up with it through a subbing group. There really is no way to watch this show outside of Japan without resorting to raws and subs. Hell, I don't even know if they COLLECT Kamen Rider in boxsets. And even so, I definitely wouldn't watch it without subs.

But then there's the flip side. There's a series called GaoGaiGar that I originally watched in sub form. Some time after that, Media Blasters began producing a dub. The dub died halfway through, and now, the rest of the DVDs are available in sub format. I'm sorry, but I'm really not gonna go out of my way to buy what I already saw in the original Japanese audio. So now it's a case of whether people will or won't depending on the availability.

[Retrofiuter]

Fans outside of Japan doesn't guarantee sales. Many people simply wouldn't bother buying it stating that they've already seen it in the superior Japanese language and currently don't have the money to buy it. Anime fans are cheap like that.

Soooo.... do you actually buy DVD when you want to watch anime?

SCOTT: I don't watch anime

Well that's not the point.
It's actually that bad to watch anime online? I mean, it's exactly the same as watching it in the TV.

[Haruhiist]

It's the same issue with, say, Kamen Rider. Right now, Kamen Rider OOO is airing in Japan, and I keep up with it through a subbing group. There really is no way to watch this show outside of Japan without resorting to raws and subs. Hell, I don't even know if they COLLECT Kamen Rider in boxsets. And even so, I definitely wouldn't watch it without subs.

But then there's the flip side. There's a series called GaoGaiGar that I originally watched in sub form. Some time after that, Media Blasters began producing a dub. The dub died halfway through, and now, the rest of the DVDs are available in sub format. I'm sorry, but I'm really not gonna go out of my way to buy what I already saw in the original Japanese audio. So now it's a case of whether people will or won't depending on the availability.

..so you're just saying you're one of those people who pirate and don't buy and support the industry?

@Retro: I feel like the Japanese feel it's bad because they think we don't ever buy anything from them. It's true that a lot of us don't, but many of us do too. Whether it be the local published ones or imports from Japan.

[Titanium Man]

..so you're just saying you're one of those people who pirate and don't buy and support the industry?

When it's reasonable I buy. But I barely watch anything in the first place. If I want to watch something, I look for it on YouTube. If it ain't there, I usually don't bother. This doesn't mean I don't support where I think it's reasonable. I have here the first two seasons of Animaniacs, Scott Pilgrim VS. The World, Bruce Lee movies...I bought these to show my support. But I'm simply not going to export Kamen Rider from Japan and proceed to do nothing with it, especially since I literally watch the episode once, then trash it. It's too much money for too little future use. Hell, I started Kamen Rider beforehand with Kamen Rider Double and I caught all of those online.

And don't accuse me of doing the same thing when I watch something online. I follow the same rule there as well - watch it once, never bother again. Besides, the guy who downloads the raws and slaps it online is more of a thief than anything. If I use something a lot, it's a part of my personal moral system to go support it, or at least buy it to show I care within a reasonable limit.

[Haruhiist]

Hey, I'm just asking. Your first post was essentially a super long way of saying pretty much nothing. This second post you posted shows a lot more of your opinion.

[Titanium Man]

Fair enough.

[Scott]

Soooo.... do you actually buy DVD when you want to watch anime?

SCOTT: I don't watch anime

Well that's not the point.
It's actually that bad to watch anime online? I mean, it's exactly the same as watching it in the TV.

All of the anime I watch has either been bought on DVD by me or my sister (Usually my sister), or is showing for free on Madman's Website (An Australian Anime distributor). Madman secured the rights to stream Fullmetal Alchemist in Australia, and that's how I watched it. I love all things FMA and I plan to buy the complete collection when it's fully released.

I also wholly prefer the English language version of anime, seeing as I understand English, and Japanese just doesn't appeal to me. I suspect people prefer the original Japanese because it sounds exotic, even if they wouldn't think that deeply about it themselves.

That said, I'm also currently watching Pokémon Best Wishes. I don't really have any hangups about how I watch anime, but if a legit method is there, I'll support it.

[Ghurdrich]

The only reason I hate dubs is because the vast majority of english "Voice actors" are complete garbage. I've found myself turned off of numerous games and shows because the acting is abhorrent. There's not much market for voice acting here, since animation is viewed as a childish thing, and really, a child doesn't give a rat's ass if you sounds like a moron. He'd probably like it more.

However, in Japan, Voice Actors (seiyuu) can make a pretty big name for themselves. Star in numerous anime, and launch a career as a pop singer or something. Because it is a lucrative career path, a lot of people strive to do it professionally, and become good because of it. And because they're good, they appear over and over again so that you recognize their names (This happens even here with genuinely good VAs. Cam Clarke, Crispin Freeman, Yuri Lowenthal, for example. Household names, almost, if you know the industry.) It's the whole thing with "You get what you pay for." If you spend bottom dollar on a crap voice acting team, you get the dub of Evangelion. However, dish out the professional bucks, and you can still end up with something that sounds really nice (The FMA dubs, for example, are very decent. There was something else, too. I think it was Hellsing.)

And in case any o' y'all haters think I'm just bullshitting to justify my weeaboo-ness, think of it this way. If Japanese voice acting is as bad as most english voice acting, and I'm just deluding myself... Well, it's in another language, so I'll never really know xD (Of course there's a third reason that I'm using it to test my ever-growing knowledge of Japanese as well, but that's a personal issue, not universal.)

[Haruhiist]

Didn't we have a thread on voice acting awhile back? :P

IMO there are 2 things that make original Japanese voice acting better than the dubs are:

When I watch an anime and I listen to the english voice acting, it feels kinda.. clunky? It's like it doesn't fit well together. Like when I watched TV shows or movies that have been dubbed over in a different language (I've seen many Korean TV series dubbed over in Chinese and a Filipino series dubbed in English), it just looks and sounds really wrong. It's bearable if I really want to watch the series and there's no other way.. but when there's the original alternative I'd rather watch it with subs.

Also, I think that in American cartoons (for example), the voice acting is less of the main way to see emotion. It's more from facial expressions/movements on the character. In Anime, it's more from the voice than facial expressions/movements. That's why when English voice acting is put on to Anime, they speak really exaggerated and it doesn't sound fitting - not to mention the exaggerated voices sound really weird.

I think it'd be cool if the English VAs would try their best to sound natural when they say Japanese names though. I mean, I know how difficult it is to sound native when you say the names (I can't say them nicely either) but it'd be more pleasant to the ears. Props to them if they're already doing that.

[fries.]

Also, It's pretty unnatural in Filipino dubs changing the characters' names from the natural Japanese to the usual names we know.

YuYu Hakusho(called Ghost Fighter in the Philippines) is known for this.

[Thiefcopy]

I never buy DVD's for anime because it's so damn expensive. I do however, end up buying a LOT of Manga. Not sure why, I guess as far as books are concerned, having a physical copy is nicer.

[TWOxACROSS]

I never buy DVD's for anime because it's so damn expensive. I do however, end up buying a LOT of Manga. Not sure why, I guess as far as books are concerned, having a physical copy is nicer.

I used to buy a lot of manga too, I just lost interest for the most part. You know, it's horribly daunting when I look at all of the manga I do have, and realize that each of those books was $10. Try it, it'll make you sad. You'll count how many volumes you have, even for just one series, and realize that like...my Hana-Kimi is 23 volumes long. $230! If there was an anime for it, and I got that instead, I'd have paid...like...maybe $40 for a box set >.< In that instance, it's $10 over time, instead of roughly $40 up front, which seems okay in the beginning, until you have a manga that's spanning over 30 volumes (and sometimes still going) :p

I will admit that sometimes the annoying thing about a dub is that they butcher names - hell, look at the parody by EgoRaptor "Girl-Chan in Paradise," it spoofs everything about anime, from horrible lip-syncs, horrible voice-acting, right down to even the absurd convoluted plots. However, most of the anime I do watch, I am okay with the English dub. Perhaps it's just that I happen to like series that usually get dubbed well :p

[Ghurdrich]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SS8lTZ3OFRw
^Not paid enough.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMmcIgwC58k
^Paid enough.

Just to give some solidity to my statements to people who didn't really know what I was talking about :p

There's also the issue that it gets super expensive. The Kara no Kyoukai blu-ray special edition box set (Which as far as I know is the only way to buy it so far) is something like $500-600 (Haven't checked recently) and, while I believe it's worth every penny, the issue is that I just don't have that much money. Not to mention, that's just cost. That doesn't include the international shipping costs or anything like that.

[Thiefcopy]

I used to buy a lot of manga too, I just lost interest for the most part. You know, it's horribly daunting when I look at all of the manga I do have, and realize that each of those books was $10. Try it, it'll make you sad. You'll count how many volumes you have, even for just one series, and realize that like...my Hana-Kimi is 23 volumes long. $230! If there was an anime for it, and I got that instead, I'd have paid...like...maybe $40 for a box set >.< In that instance, it's $10 over time, instead of roughly $40 up front, which seems okay in the beginning, until you have a manga that's spanning over 30 volumes (and sometimes still going) :p

I will admit that sometimes the annoying thing about a dub is that they butcher names - hell, look at the parody by EgoRaptor "Girl-Chan in Paradise," it spoofs everything about anime, from horrible lip-syncs, horrible voice-acting, right down to even the absurd convoluted plots. However, most of the anime I do watch, I am okay with the English dub. Perhaps it's just that I happen to like series that usually get dubbed well :p

I've got a good 60+ of Bleach and Naruto.....Damn. Got 26 for DBZ, and a good 20 or so Eyeshield 21's.

Thanks Belts, now I'm depressed at the amount of money I've spent!

[Khell]

I'd love to see comparisons for how stuff would sell before and after a dubbing company has the rights to the anime. I kinda like what Funimation has been doing with episodes on their Youtube channel, using their english subtitles and the original Japanese voices.

[テツヤ Kuroko]

I'd love to see comparisons for how stuff would sell before and after a dubbing company has the rights to the anime. I kinda like what Funimation has been doing with episodes on their Youtube channel, using their english subtitles and the original Japanese voices.

They also upload dub episodes to their official website aswell.