It's time to return the wind to the world! Discussion thread

[Cookies]

Now that's an awesome changelist :3

[gray_kaiser]

Thanks Cookies :3

[Kayarine]

I think you should add to the cons that Bartz has bad vertical range outside of his HP attacks and that most of his attacks are very laggy (long cooldown.)

The passive bonus is always helpful. More EX Intake means more EX Force, which means you fill up your EX bar faster. Even if you don't care for the EX bar or are using Side by Side, you're still denying it to your opponent, which is always great.

Nope. Side By Side does not let the character absorb any EX force at all. As in, s/he will not get the EX force; all of it will stay in the field.


As for Hazard Rush... It's a decent mid range punisher, as it has better horizontal range than Blade Crash and Solid Ascension and a better startup than Reel Impulse. But like his other ground BRV moves, it's vertically challenged, and it also doesn't have very good tracking even on startup.

Comboing Hazard Rush into assists can be done at the second Beat Rush punch (the one before the last one that initiates chase) unless you're using a slow midair assist.


I'd imagine that Reel Impulse vs Hazard Rush depends on matchup. I know from experience with Firion that Reel Axe will be mostly too risky (and almost useless) against close range characters. For those matchups, I bring Lance Combo instead. Bartz could probably do the same and bring Hazard Rush.


Worth to note about Rush Impact is that it has some really bad cooldown. Whiffing this upclose will most likely get Bartz punished, so it must be used with caution. It's also fairly vertically challenged.


Slide Shooter is a notable dodge punisher. It can be used after the opponent dodges (so Slide Shooter catches them as their dodge frames end,) so it's a bit easier to use for this purpose since you can react to the dodge animation. Since it needs to be used a bit later because of the lack of tracking/vertical range, it can be clashed with if the opponent has a quick aerial move or blocked by block moves such as Shield of Light and Wrath Particle Beam. While it's quite nice for punishing dodges, it's not very hard for the opponent to dodge over Bartz to avoid it since the move is (yet again) vertically challenged.


It should be mentioned that Holy is cancelable into any other attacks without the need for a dodge cancel. So when trying to pull off the link glitch, you can just keep mashing Holy without DCing. Although one should watch if the opponent is blocking or dashing through the first wave of Holy, as it'll usually hit Bartz as he's casting the second wave. If the opponent reflects them, reflecting them back and distracting the opponent with other attacks may make them get hit by the reflected Holy orbs, which can combo into Rush Impact if close enough.


Luminous Shard is very good for forcing dodges because of the tracking, which in turn can be punished by assists. So it's great for when you need to land that last hit and you have an assist meter. Just make sure to not use it when the opponent themselves have assist, of course.


Solid guide, sticking it.

[Cookies]

You could help him edit it Kaya.

[Kayarine]

Nah, the guide is not mine so I won't edit it. =p I'll only edit it if the original poster becomes inactive and isn't around to update it.

[Cookies]

I see, what I meant was more playing an assisting role, not just changing it :P

It doesn't matter though.

[gray_kaiser]

Kaya's the master... =P

[Balguna]

I'd be glad if you did that, gray_kaiser, but I'd rather you post it in the Assists and Combos thread so I don't end up clogging the thread with too many videos as well. It'd be good to give that thread more attention too.

I've trimmed the moves a little, added the changelist, and thrown in some of the suggestions in, thanks a lot Kaya and Cookies and gray. I've also added in Terra in the Assist section. She's definitely a situational Assist and I don't think she's really better than Aerith for EX gathering, though.

I didn't add the support abilities in the changelist because I've already mentioned them under the moves themselves. As for Bartz's exclusives, I might add it in if I do an Equipping section (whether in the actual thread or making a separate one). Bartz's exclusive isn't really anything to be amazed about regardless, due to its low Attack and lackluster effect. Gungnir and Earthbreaker are simply better, and even Heaven's Cloud is better for an EX build. Bartz can use every weapon anyway, but unlike Firion, his exclusive doesn't really play to it.

As for Hazard Raid/Reel Impulse, I've been toying with them both, and you make a good point about Bartz's vertical reach. It's really lacking, which is why I'm thinking Reel Impulse is becoming more and more important. Hellfire is still more useful for covering anti-air, however. I've thought about just replacing Blade Crash/Solid Ascension with Hazard Raid entirely. You'd lose out on a hefty amount of damage for doing so, though, but the coverage by Hazard Raid is worth considering.

Again, thanks for all the feedback! I appreciate all of it, and do feel free to contribute more.

[Wotan]

My observations:
-While it is hard to wall rush on the ceiling with Slide Shooter, Holy became a great followup to this move, able to track opponent no matter where he dodges to. Even the AI is often fooled by this chain of attacks (provided that you managed to hit with Slide Shooter though).
-Dark Flame has good vertical tracking not only upwards, but also downwards. Coupled with the ability to pass through walls, it can reserve nasty surprises in stages like the Rift, if you attack from over a ledge.
-The best way I found to use Goblin Punch is to dash towards the opponent, while keeping R pressed release Triangle then immediately press Square. While Goblin Punch does not protect Bartz from projectiles, it has a high probability to interrupt the opponent if you catch his character's body (as Goblin Punch has Unblockable priority, it wins over other HP attacks). For example, I once managed to block Sephiroth's Hell's Gate with it. On the other hand, it can't stop Tidus' Stick & Move.

[gray_kaiser]

Here's the vid Bal. Use it of you find it useful...
Nothing too flashy IMO...