Love or Loathe?

**Firestorm** · 04-17-2011 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Neo Bahamut

Okay, there are definitely characters, even in Dissidia, who are less approachable than Lightning. Half the cast calls her "Light." Can you imagine trying to call Shantotto "Shanty"? First of all, I loved how all of her lines in the earlier chapters/prologus could be effectively replaced with "Don't tell me what to do." Then after that, I really started to see the whole "female Cloud" thing the developers were on about. Although I think she's more of a leader-type than Cloud.

You wanna elaborate?

Well, the ones who were unapproachable in DDFF, are more unapproachable in their normal games, she's nothing like her FFXIII counterpart in DDFF... She's more approachable in FFXIII than she is in DDFF, a LOT more approachable, and her traits in FFXIII are completely different to her traits in DDFF.

As for the elaborate part, I mean I liked how you could make different paradigms and change at any time to fit the circumstance.

**Neo Bahamut** · 04-17-2011 12:32 PM

So, what, like the Dressphere system?

And if that's true, why does everyone say she's some kind of insufferable bitch?

I really can't use any other term for her, because that's the exact term that I keep hearing.

**Narolf** · 04-17-2011 12:43 PM

I have to say, I am completely shocked someone liked Lightning in DDFF, IMO DDFF completely raped her character into some machine only capable of insulting others, and her personality was completely thrown in a blender, but that's just me.

I think this can be applied to the whole cast of Dissidia tho, minus WoL and Garland.

Dissidia butchers characters for the needs of an oversimplified story. It makes them standard anianimu characters while they always had been more than those. I can't figure how one can appreciate the Squall of Dissidia without playing VIII beforehand.

On topic, what I liked the most about XIII is how four of the main characters (out of six) are carets and not "chosen ones" or any of that crap. They do dish-washing, they celebrate a birthday, they enjoy a firework at night, they date...and they save the world at the end. You could've had been a protagonist of XIII and that really strenghtens the tying you feel towards the characters and their respective story.

The story isn't hard to understand as long as you take the time to read the datalog.

I got a really fond memory of this game despite the whole bashing it suffered from all over the Net and which I was aware of even before purchasing it. Don't be biased by those who keep complaining about how FF is getting unrooted since VII: they keep buying FFs, one after one, and spite on them, one after one. It's part of the magic of the serie, I guess.

**Neo Bahamut** · 04-17-2011 12:51 PM

Well, I suppose that last part is true. But you figure there must at least be a basis for the complaining. Cloud's not "emo," but he is down for the majority of the media he's in any more.

All I felt for the characters of XII was a desire for the few semi-decent ones to brutally murder the rest.

**Saint Vegas** · 04-17-2011 12:55 PM

Final Fantasy X is the antichrist.

If it isn't Yuna being the most pathetic heroine the series has ever had to offer...

It's Tidus being an annoying ADD retard. Toss in Seymour, who is beyond words lame, weak sauce uber-ham-fisted romance and an almost non-existent supporting cast* and the game, at least in my opinion, is a headache that only gets worse as time goes on. And then there is that LAUGHING scene...

Not that it's without its merits. Some of the music is very good, although Yuna's theme is like a Yoko Kanno 'remix' in that it's completely stolen/rehashed/whatever from an FF7 track-- Rikku and Auron are especially cool, Sin and most of the anti-religious establishment plot is strong and the gameplay itself, minus the horrifyingly un-fun minigames, is good. Aeon battles are also pretty decent.

But then there is that laughing scene.

And I shouldn't have to explain why Kingdom Hearts' story went to hell. It's called Kingdom Hearts II aka The Mickey Mouse Matrix Revolutions.

If I seem especially vitriolic-- I can't apologize, because it's just how I do.

Anyway, concerning Dissidia's story, why do we even BOTHER talking about it? I mean, regardless of how much better 012 is to 013 (lightyears more entertaining, fyi)... It's ultimately just a fanfic. It's a non-canon Square sanctioned fanfic and... uh, it plays out like one. A decent one, but it's nothing to write home about. In the pantheon of Fighting Games, it's pretty good. As a story, there are better written dramatic episodes of Ellen.

*CLARIFICATION: not anyone within the main party, but most of the tertiary characters like the Aurochs, Guado, Chocobo knight chicks, et cet. I mean there are honestly only two good supporting characters-- O'Aka and Cid, and they're like... Technically not that important. When you consider the presence of say, The Turks, Zidane's uh... shipmates, the Judge Magisters, or Ellone and the Laguna Time Retro-Crew or the Disciplinary Committee, FFX's supporting cast isn't just vacuous, it's anemic and sad and other elaborate words of fail.)

**Neo Bahamut** · 04-17-2011 12:59 PM

I am honestly less concerned that you think FFX & KH are bad (although still concerned) & more concerned that you think XII is high-class storytelling.

**Narolf** · 04-17-2011 01:06 PM

But you figure there must at least be a basis for the complaining.

People were expecting a FF-Psone type (aka rather open-world, not completely linear, which requires you to talk to everyone before the story progresses...) for XIII, the kind of game which consumes a LOT of time and is just too much for the casual, young and lazy HD-gamers, those who started gaming with the current gen. However, the fans of the PSX era are adult now and don't have time to play as much. XIII was designed to find a compromise between the two audiences and to go straight to what developers think essential in a FF: the story and the characters.

I don't know if it's a bad thing or not. All what I'm sure of is this is how the game was intended to be from the beginning and that was announced long before the Japanese release.

**Saint Vegas** · 04-17-2011 01:07 PM

Now you get to see me leave with the girl-- I mean, win.

FFXII aka Actual Writing:

REDDAS: How can you persist in this folly?
DR. CID: Hahah- And you've come here to stop me? I feign to see you try.
BALTHIER: Consider your bones, old man. You're outmatched.
DR. CID: Pirate scum of the skies! What brings you here?
BALTHIER: Treasure, of course. What else would a pirate want? We'll take the dusk shard.
DR. CID: That trinket? I thought you above this-- Huh? What's that?... *Talks to invisible voice over shoulder creepily* Ahh.....
The princess of Dalmasca come to visit... She's not entirely without merit.... Well then- A TRIAL FOR ASHELIA B'NARGIN DALMASCA!

FFX aka The Antichrist:

Yuna & Tidus: AHAHHA~
Yuna: TOO FUNNY.
Tidus: This is so WEIRD.
Yuna: Tee hee I want my journey... to be.. full... of... laughter...
Tidus: Well excuse me princess!
Yuna: *whistles*

Like Fortune, one of my fellow black crusaders, said in Metal Gear Solid 2-- Kill Me Now.

Note that the biggest narrative flaw in FFXII is actually one of game design-- the game is simply so damn big and s full of constant sidequests that if you're any sort of perfectionist (and we all know we are, and use gamefaqs or own guides)-- you'll go hours at a time between cutscenes LET ALONE actual substantial plot progression. FFX's biggest problem is that the protagonists have bipolar II.

At least Yunalesca was pretty dope.

I do think FFXIII's story could have benefited from additional NPC dialogue. The story is EXTREMELY HIGH CONCEPT, even in the wake of FF8, and because you really don't have any NPC's reinforcing information you learn in the cutscenes, if you miss ANYTHING or don't get it/misinterpret, you're more or less screwed. To be frank, I'd have less of an understanding of the villain's evil plot if I didn't have the strategy guide that more or less explains it. It's a really cool evil plot, too, which is a shame, cause I can only assume others didn't get it either.

**Narolf** · 04-17-2011 01:17 PM

I do think FFXIII's story could have benefited from additional NPC dialogue. The story is EXTREMELY HIGH CONCEPT, even in the wake of FF8, and because you really don't have any NPC's reinforcing information you learn in the cutscenes, if you miss ANYTHING or don't get it/misinterpret, you're more or less screwed. To be frank, I'd have less of an understanding of the villain's evil plot if I didn't have the strategy guide that more or less explains it. It's a really cool evil plot, too, which is a shame, cause I can only assume others didn't get it either.

People don't read the datalog.

**Neo Bahamut** · 04-17-2011 01:20 PM

Most of XII's writing revolves around the heavy use of synonyms & faux Old English to make it sound more sophisticated than it actually is. And I'm talking about the substance, not the witty reparte. I don't care how fancy you can make your insults if the biggest praise to your story is "Star Wars rip off."

I am getting off track here, but I'm honestly not sure what else to ask.