Good moveset for Vaan?

**Slothmonster** · 04-04-2012 10:17 AM

My Setup is:

Ground:
Neutral- Katana
Forward- Greatsword
Away- Rifle

Air:
Neutral- Axe and Shield
Forward- Spear
Away- Greatsword

I feel that my setup is rather decent, the only reason I have the rifle on the ground is just incase the battle takes the ground for any reason. My setup is mainly aimed at fighting in the air, and instead of having another dodge in the air with Rifle I just have Precision Evasion and Evasion boost to make up for it.

Does anyone actually use Cataclsym outside of an assist combo? I find it really not worth it to have at all. :T

**Vamper62** · 04-05-2012 12:15 AM

Originally Posted by Nachtauge

Spoiler:

The build looks pretty good in terms of abilities, though I personally don't use all three of my ground BRV slots (I like to stick to A&S and Katana for ground, switching in Crossbow for certain matchups). You might not need both Achy+ + BttW and CA + SA criticals, but if you like using both, that's fine I guess. It just comes off quite expensive. I personally love Vaan's exclusive weapon since it comes with free Riposte, which often activates due to a number of Vaan's moves causing Stagger (Greatsword (charged switch), Spear (switch), Katana, and S&S). That or Gungnir (Lv 100 Spear) for a weapon. I also tend to use a Judgement of Lufenia set (Helm, Armor/Chestplate, Shield).

Also, since I use Vaan's exclusive (which improves EX Core absorption), I also like to use Dragonfly Orb as well. This helps offset Vaan's mediocre EX production and makes EX Cores more effective for him. I personally can't go without EX on Vaan, but that is my personal preference. You could probably drop Battle Gem, Battle Ring, Strum and Drang, and Together As One. If anything, you can always start a match off with First to Victory instead of Together As One (although the bonus is less for Assists). You could also use Rebellious Soul if you plan to use Achy+, since it provides a 2000+ brv on near death. You might not need Hyper Ring AND Booster. I'd drop one, maybe add a different Basic Accessory and fill most of the rest of the slots with boosters. I recommend either Self or Opp HP < 50% and/or HP < 25%. They provide good boosters that help in tight matches (for either side). You could also try (instead of Pre-EX) Before or After Summon boosters. They are quite reliable and easy to maintain.

It seems, based on your build, you are having trouble building assists. Non-Switch Spear, S&S, and A&S are decent builders which are somewhat safe. As a Vaan player, I try to stay fairly aggressive, so I don't typically worry too much about my Assist Gauge Duration since I'm always trying to get attacks in. Just be sure not to get careless with your attacks since Vaan is somewhat punishable if you aren't careful. On the bright side, Vaan is a great dodge punishes and Rifle can cover dodges as well. I also personally choose either Sephi or Jecht for an assist. Since I do at times activate my assists off of ground wall rushes, I like having a fast and safer ground assist link. Torrent works amazing with Jecht combos and Sephi is just a little safer than Kuja. Just my two cents.

Originally Posted by Slothmonster

My Setup is:

Ground:
Neutral- Katana
Forward- Greatsword
Away- Rifle

Air:
Neutral- Axe and Shield
Forward- Spear
Away- Greatsword

I feel that my setup is rather decent, the only reason I have the rifle on the ground is just incase the battle takes the ground for any reason. My setup is mainly aimed at fighting in the air, and instead of having another dodge in the air with Rifle I just have Precision Evasion and Evasion boost to make up for it.

Does anyone actually use Cataclsym outside of an assist combo? I find it really not worth it to have at all. :T

You don't need Greatsword both on the ground an the air (so just stick to the air one). I can't imagine not using Rifle in the air. It is such a great move and Vaan spends most of the time in the air anyways. I also find S&S better in the air than A&S (which is better on the ground imo). On the ground, you may not need more than 2 BRV attacks (unless the matchup calls for it). Spear is preference move, and works better in some matchups than others (though I personally love the move in close range intensive matchups as a Air Dash punisher).

As for Cataclysm, I think it is a solid move. It is fairly fast and has some decent vertical height. However, Torrent is just plain superior in most ways (except level of punishability). You can go without Cataclysm on matches that spend most of the time in the air, but if the match has more ground fighting, Cataclysm has its uses outside if assist combos (it just takes practice).

**Slothmonster** · 04-05-2012 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by Vamper62

You don't need Greatsword both on the ground an the air (so just stick to the air one). I can't imagine not using Rifle in the air. It is such a great move and Vaan spends most of the time in the air anyways. I also find S&S better in the air than A&S (which is better on the ground imo). On the ground, you may not need more than 2 BRV attacks (unless the matchup calls for it). Spear is preference move, and works better in some matchups than others (though I personally love the move in close range intensive matchups as a Air Dash punisher).

As for Cataclysm, I think it is a solid move. It is fairly fast and has some decent vertical height. However, Torrent is just plain superior in most ways (except level of punishability). You can go without Cataclysm on matches that spend most of the time in the air, but if the match has more ground fighting, Cataclysm has its uses outside if assist combos (it just takes practice).

I can see that I don't need GS both in the air and on the ground, the only reason i have it on the ground is for the non-switch attack to catch someone off guard possibly. But I do agree, I should change it just not sure what to. I've tried using Spear on the ground but find it to be rather awkward to use. I thought of the Staff but find that more useful in the air anyways. I might try your idea of putting AS on the ground, but as for SS its hard for me to find it useful or not be trigger happy with it which makes it obvious when I start to use it. I'll try, though. Thanks for the input man. I'll play around with my setup today and see how it goes.

I may have to try using Cataclysm a little more then, I've always found it rather difficult to use and always end up getting punished when using it against certain characters so found that its not really worth it. But I'll try adding it to my arsenal when the match calls for it.

**Nachtauge** · 04-06-2012 09:25 PM

Spoiler:

[QUOTE=Vamper62;363553]The build looks pretty good in terms of abilities, though I personally don't use all three of my ground BRV slots (I like to stick to A&S and Katana for ground, switching in Crossbow for certain matchups). You might not need both Achy+ + BttW and CA + SA criticals, but if you like using both, that's fine I guess. It just comes off quite expensive. I personally love Vaan's exclusive weapon since it comes with free Riposte, which often activates due to a number of Vaan's moves causing Stagger (Greatsword (charged switch), Spear (switch), Katana, and S&S). That or Gungnir (Lv 100 Spear) for a weapon. I also tend to use a Judgement of Lufenia set (Helm, Armor/Chestplate, Shield).

Also, since I use Vaan's exclusive (which improves EX Core absorption), I also like to use Dragonfly Orb as well. This helps offset Vaan's mediocre EX production and makes EX Cores more effective for him. I personally can't go without EX on Vaan, but that is my personal preference. You could probably drop Battle Gem, Battle Ring, Strum and Drang, and Together As One. If anything, you can always start a match off with First to Victory instead of Together As One (although the bonus is less for Assists). You could also use Rebellious Soul if you plan to use Achy+, since it provides a 2000+ brv on near death. You might not need Hyper Ring AND Booster. I'd drop one, maybe add a different Basic Accessory and fill most of the rest of the slots with boosters. I recommend either Self or Opp HP < 50% and/or HP < 25%. They provide good boosters that help in tight matches (for either side). You could also try (instead of Pre-EX) Before or After Summon boosters. They are quite reliable and easy to maintain.

It seems, based on your build, you are having trouble building assists. Non-Switch Spear, S&S, and A&S are decent builders which are somewhat safe. As a Vaan player, I try to stay fairly aggressive, so I don't typically worry too much about my Assist Gauge Duration since I'm always trying to get attacks in. Just be sure not to get careless with your attacks since Vaan is somewhat punishable if you aren't careful. On the bright side, Vaan is a great dodge punishes and Rifle can cover dodges as well. I also personally choose either Sephi or Jecht for an assist. Since I do at times activate my assists off of ground wall rushes, I like having a fast and safer ground assist link. Torrent works amazing with Jecht combos and Sephi is just a little safer than Kuja. Just my two cents.

I appreciate this advice man. My build has actually changed quite a bit since this though. Here's what I run now.

Spoiler:

HP: 9377
CP: 450/450
BRV: 1036
ATK:178
DEF: 185 (hell yeah)
LUK: 60

The Ace's Helm is actually an artifact. It's still that Polarity, with Drop Rate Boost and EXP +69%. I run the Blurry Moon simply for the +1 to ATK. I find it helps, but there has to be something better I can put there.

As far as extra abilities, they changed somewhat. Achy+ is still there to give me a better chance of swinging a match in my favor without having to be so close to death, and it works well with me. I also run Back to the Wall. I still run Counterattack and Sneak Attack because 1. invariably at least one of those is disabled and 2. I love me some critical hits. I also have Assist Critical Boost and since I use Kuja, this often pays off extremely well. I have Disable Counterattack and HP to Assist, as well as Equip Machines.

For actions, I have all the standard fare. I use Free Air Dash 'cause I prefer it. Omni Ground Dash+, but that mostly jives with my playstyle because I feel if I am dashing close to the ground I should use ground abilites right off of a dash if I want. Free Air Dash Boost lets me utilize the Zodiac Blade's EX Core Absorption+ 30% to its fullest I think, and allows Vaan to haul ass. Aside from that, the only thing I have is Evasion Boost.

I agree with you on the aggressive playstyle. I'm constantly assaulting my opponent and doing what I feel Vaan was designed to: rapid implementation of on-the-fly tactics. So I am always switching weapons and dashing around and causing a ruckus.

I've also found that I don't have a particularly difficult time building Assist. I can usually get Kuja out in one SW Axe and one normal Axe, and then that begins my first worthwhile combo of a match.

**Vamper62** · 04-06-2012 11:27 PM

Originally Posted by Nachtauge

Spoiler:

Why did you move to Crossbow? I personally find Rifle (and I'm positive other big Vaan mains would agree) way better. Crossbow is decent as a Dodge punisher, but in terms of its own punishability from assists, it can be a disaster. You need to be very careful when using this against more experienced players (and certain matchup make it more viable than others like against Exdeath, which goes through some of his counter guards). Rifle can cover dodges and is harder to punish (although, you need to take some time to get used to using it).

Also, I still don't understand Strum and Drang, it is a horrible accessory compared to other things you already have set in terms of basics. You would get much more out of another booster (which btw, the three you have is definitely not enough). I couldn't imagine going without 5-6 boosters.

Also, just as a note (and don't feel stupid if you didn't know this), do understand that Comrades Vow ONLY activates when you take HP DAMAGE. Many people make this mistake as the game doesn't really give a good ability description for it. For this reason, I don't typically recommend Comrades Vow when it kills your EX Intake range (which if it gets around a -2m from multipliers disables EX Force Absorption completely). I'd switch in Dragonfly Orb (for EX Core Absorption) and it should offset and make Together as One work perfectly fine without hurting Vaan's EX efficiency much (I use it in this fashion on one of my builds as well). So long as you remain an EX Core Whore, you should be fine. Just keep aggressive to avoid Assist Depletion.

I also am not sure I understand what you mean is only takes one Switch plus a nonswitch A&S to get enough for an assist... That only occurs for the first one since you're employing TaO. Elsewhere on the match, you might have more trouble (but again, if you're playing Vaan right by staying aggressive and providing high pressure, assists shouldn't pose too much of a problem).

Also, I don't know what rulesets you play with, but just as a reminder, Artifacts are banned in Official rulesets, so it won't be very common for a player to let you use them online (unless you are playing casual customs with friends).

**Nachtauge** · 04-06-2012 11:43 PM

I moved to Crossbow because I feel that Rifle just doesn't do what it's intended to very well. It's quite possible that it was just me getting lazy with my dodging thanks to Evasion Boost, but I don't appreciate it very much. It seems to get me punished whenever I use it.

I run Sturm und Drang because I like to capitalize on my Wall Rush BRV damage. The Physical Damage boost helps as well. Yes, I could easily change it out for another Booster accessory, and I probably should, but this works too. I am always experimenting.

Yes, I am quite aware A Comrade's Vow only Assist charges on you taking damage. It's a weird way to play on my build, but it works since I have Achy+, Back to the Wall and Rebellious Soul, meaning that whenever I take HP damage, I get closer to my trump card anyway and I build Assist. So that's what I think.

I did mean that A&S charges on my first combo, and since I do play aggressively, if I can spook my opponent early on into making stupid mistakes by bullrushing them, it just means the rest of the match is that much easier.

Aaaand lastly I don't play against other humans often at all. I would love to be able to. I lack a PS3 and plus I lack a stable internet connection that I can access regularly, but I have a HEN on my PSP and I could probably use XLink Kai easily enough.

**RavenCarver** · 04-07-2012 04:50 AM

Originally Posted by Nachtauge

.... I could probably use XLink Kai easily enough.

If it was easy to use.

**Thancruz** · 05-16-2012 07:27 AM

Cataclysm is a solid move indeed, assist combos just make it more viable to land. Outside of that it's a move you can use to kind of catch opponents off guard. I was playing a Vaan mirror with my friend, and I was dashing from the air expecting him to Torrent me, but I didn't expect a Cata to the face, shit I completely forgot he even had that move. People need to respect his ground game lol.

**Natsu** · 05-24-2012 09:52 AM

Does anyone know a free styled movelist set up in the air like onion knight/tidus set up? I like to attack rush at my oppenents and punish their errors like i do with onion knight.

I was thinking

Ground:
Neutral- Katana
Forward- Spear
Away- crossbow
Air:
Neutral- Greatsword
Forward- Sword and shield
Away- Rifle

This might be wrong but thats what i am considering right now.

The thing about vann is i havent found what is comfortable, but i am hoping with some advice and my new found determation i will find the set up that is right for me.

**Vamper62** · 05-25-2012 12:06 AM

Originally Posted by Natsu

Does anyone know a free styled movelist set up in the air like onion knight/tidus set up? I like to attack rush at my oppenents and punish their errors like i do with onion knight.

I was thinking

Ground:
Neutral- Katana
Forward- Spear
Away- crossbow
Air:
Neutral- Greatsword
Forward- Sword and shield
Away- Rifle

This might be wrong but thats what i am considering right now.

The thing about vann is i havent found what is comfortable, but i am hoping with some advice and my new found determation i will find the set up that is right for me.

I typically change up my moveset based on the matchup. What works against one doesn't always work as well against another. Taking into consideration aggression levels, assist building, EX generation, covers, priority, and speed are all important factors when choosing Vaan's moves for a certain matchup. Learn to be comfortable with just about everything and anything.